Summer Onley interview

Summary

Summer Onley is a professional MMA fighter representing Ronin MMA, she is currently 6-0 and captured and defended the FCC title and has defended it leading her to get a call to the Dana White contender series in the coming weeks. We discuss a range of topics, from starting MMA…

Transcript (youtube_captions)

absolute pleasure to have join me Summer Onley. H she's going to be going to stay in the White Tennis series very soon. H I noticed her uh a while ago and then I seen an interview with her and and it she really kind of irked my interest as well, especially h being a female in the sport and I'm one of the people within Ireland that wants to kind of push females and I really really liked her story cuz she didn't start like everyone else did as they were young. She started 25 and and just uh the way she's kind of catapulted into where she is now is just it's such a good story and I really want people to hear it. So, thank you very much for your time. Congratulations on your career today and we know there's a lot more coming. How are you today? >> Yeah, I'm pretty good. I'm pretty good. I mean, um, yeah, I mean, obviously there was always speculation that I was going to go to the UFC or going to go on Dana White's Contender Series. And if I'm honest, like I was watching everyone else in the UK get signed to Dana White's Contender Series throughout the like previous months and I was like, "Oh man, like when like come on, I'm six and0. Like why have I not been called yet?" And then um we got like a call from a management company like three or four weeks ago now. Um someone that my coach knows and uh yeah, he rolled me up at quarter 6 in the morning. I was obviously asleep and my fiance next to me, he was fuming at it, but then he woke us up. He's like, "Oh my god, Summer, we've done it. We're in the UFC. Come on now. Come on." So, I was absolutely buzzing after that. There's a good phone call to be woken up to. So, um yeah, it's just um a very surreal time honestly. Like, I've gone from the amateur ranks and then the like all through FCC and you know, I've only ever really fought in Liverpool. And so even the feeling, even like me knowing that I get to go to Las Vegas and fight there, I get to fight in front of Dana White and like there's going to be lots of people watching because obviously it's a really popular show. It's just it's like a real pinch me moment. A real pinch me moment if I'm honest. I'm ben. >> I can imagine. As and has your fiance forgiven you for being walking over at that time? I'm assuming he's as happy as you are as well >> regardless of the time it came out. It was like 5 seconds later he was like, "Yeah, well done. Well done." But at the time he was fuming. Yeah. >> Yeah. No, I do get that. But like like you said, getting that call you've seen people that have been looking and getting the call like did you think it was going to happen or did you know it was going to happen over time or was it because a lot of people got before you were like is this going to happen? But I think as a female at 6 and0 with all finishes as well like I think you should have been so cuz and this isn't because there isn't a a huge pool of females like there is males to choose from. you know the sort of a way and that's not me saying anything about the female saying it's just the kind of facts of the matter >> that didn't at 6 and know I would have thought immediately straight up like what was that kind of time were you thinking is it not going to happen or did you know it would happen eventually like what was that kind of emotions like seeing other people get signed >> so I think I think the problem is is that I was comparing myself to other people that were in the UFC so obviously um yeah there are girls from the UK that got signed straight away to the UK um UFC FC without going through D watch contender series with smaller records than I have. And I was a bit like, "Oh man, this is a bummer." Like especially after not like last November when I won the FCC title, I was like, "Come on now. This is it. This has got to be it." Like I'm a champion now and I've got like five and0, I've got four finishes, blah blah blah. I was like, "What else do I need to do?" And then obviously nothing really happened. And then I went on holiday, came back in January and then my coach was like, "Yeah, you've been matched to defend your belt on FCC." And I was like low. No, I wasn't like disappointed. Obviously I was a bit like oh man like I thought maybe there'd be a chance that because obviously we had the London card in March like just gone. So I was like oh maybe I could have been on that. But it is what it is. I thought I think it was like a week before um and then I defended my belt and then I was just like right I'll just leave it. I'll just leave it and see what happened. like I didn't, you know, my my coach was basically I'd done four backto-back fight camps and I was like dead inside really if I'm honest and I needed a break. So, I kind of took a couple of weeks off training after that fight in March and then I kind of sat back and I was like, well, what if we don't get the the Contender Series shot this year? You know, what what if that doesn't happen? What if I don't get called up to the UFC? Um, obviously I'm like against the clock. Not against the clock, but I'm like I'm 32. I'm a little bit older than most people that when they get into the UFC. So, I'm a bit like I just need to go. I just need to have fights and fights and fights. And then obviously the June card on FCC came and gone. So, I' I'd never defended my belt. And then there was talks about me defending it in September. So, then I was like, yeah, okay, I'll prepare for September. Um, and then in the back of my mind, I was still like, well, there might be a chance I could get on Dana White Contender Series. And then I just didn't really hear anything about it. And then whilst I was in preparation for maybe defending my belt, I was like got that call and I was like, "Yes, yes, I finally get to do it. I finally get to do it." I mean, like I know there's been Yeah, like there's been a few people that have said that, you know, maybe you should have got the shot after your last like um when I won the belt, but I was a bit like no. I think there was something else I needed to prove. Obviously, I got like a finish in that fight and then I got a finish in my um my defense and so I was a bit like no now's the time like and that girl right that the girl that I fought in my last fight she was seven and two she was like one of the biggest prospects out out of Brazil and if I'm honest I like she she was by far my toughest opponent and I um you know and she was taller than me which I wasn't used to. I'm normally taller so it was quite nice to get a different look. So, I'm really glad that I had to go through another fight. I mean, like I always think that everything happens for a reason and there was, you know, I needed to have another win to get like solidify myself as being someone that could potentially get in the Daily Watch content series. So, I thought it would always be there, but I just didn't know when. I just didn't know when. >> Yeah. And like you said, getting that other test and facing a style and a body type that you haven't before is really beneficial before you do take that step up into the UFC as well because obviously your opponent was very good. When you go to UFC, there's going to be opponents like that as well. So, you've got a taste of of someone cuz when I was looking at your record, everyone you fought has either been like same amount of fights yet or had more. So, you've always fought up. You've always fought to improve and get better and these things. But look, one of the things is I want to kind of explore is you're after getting there, but where did you start and why did you start? Like what what what led you to MMA? So, it is basically my fiancé. I I had never heard of the UFC or had no idea what MMA that like the only thing that I knew about was my my little my big sister, sorry, did karate when she was younger and got a black belt and then my parents wanted me to do it and I was like, no. I was like a proper girly girl. I never wanted to do that kind of thing. And then when I met him in like 2016, he was mad into the UFC. So I was like, when I stayed around one time, he was like, "Oh, do you mind if I watch the UFC?" I was like, "I have no idea what that is. You pop it on, you have a good time." So then we started watching it and I was like, "Okay, this is pretty this is pretty good. I like this. I like this." And like I love the aspect that there was so many different things in it. Like it wasn't just kickboxing, it wasn't just jiu-jitsu, it was everything. Um I think like the first fight that I watched was Yan Jan Jek against someone I can't remember but I was like man she's a dog like that's amazing to see like it's so cool. So then I lived in Northampton this year and then once I moved to Derby in 2017 I think um I went to my first jiu-jitsu session because I was like well I just want to try out the grappling that's what I really like. I like when I watch um the UFC like all the grapplers. So I started doing grappling and like I just loved it. I just loved it. Like going to the gym was a bit like boring for me. I like the fact that in jiu-jitsu and MMA you're like never going to learn everything and it's like a constant open book. Like there's always going to be new things you need to learn. So I loved it straight away. I started competing in jiu-jitsu at like white and blue belt. I was doing it all the time. I was just like super competitive with it. And then one of my teammates Allan, he was uh fighting in like September or something. I can't remember the date. Um, but you know, I went along to support him and watch him and then there was like these two girls fighting at the same time like on the prelim card or something and I was like, you know what, like I reckon I reckon I could do that. I reckon I could do that. You know, I'm not a very good striker at the time. I wasn't very good at striking, but I was really I was okay at jiu-jitsu. I'd say that was my forte. So then I begged my coach to have an amateur fight and he was like m like for months and months and eventually he let me fight in like late 2019. Like luckily just before COVID happened, I managed to get two fights in. Um, and yeah, the rest is history. I just loved it. I think I love the fact that it's like I've competed in jiu-jitsu and MMA, but MMA is just like it's like a different level of adrenaline. It's crazy how like how good you feel afterwards. Obviously, like the losses are crap. Like no one likes losses, but you know, the adrenaline that you get being in a cage, it's just so good. Like I've just never felt anything like it. >> Yeah. Like explain it. when you get in and that cage door is shut and it's just you and another female across from you, like a lot of people might get psyched out in that kind of situation or they might go cuz I even know a lot of fighters who would be pro fighters. I said sometimes when the cage doctors are like they kind of have a little think to themselves and they get like a little bit of doubt and go what are you doing here? Even though they could be a pro for ages. Do any of those things still happen to you after a while? Like do you still get the the emotions like not negative emotions but like kind of butterflies nervousness? Cuz I think people if you're not really I think if people are too calm going in sometimes I think sometimes it might not be a good sign. It might be either that they don't care enough or not. Like what kind of emotions do you get now still going into a cage? >> No. Like I I think you know what I feel the best when I'm in a cage. The only time that I didn't feel good when I walked into a cage is my only loss at amateur. I remember going into the cage and it was a silver lander that I was fighting and I just I just remember thinking like I don't think I'm going to win this. Like I just don't think I've got it. And like that's the only doubt that I've ever had when I've gone into a cage. Normally like I'm like yeah let's just get this done. Like another wind's coming. Like I'm I'm very sure of myself. But be like prior to getting into the cage, that's when I have the doubt. Like you know when you see my fight poster go up like for Dana White Contender Series, like when everyone knows who I'm fighting, I'm like I'm going to get mad butterflies. I'm going to get nervous. I'll rewatch her fights and be like, "Oh my god." Like I don't know how I'm going to win against her. And then that's like only a short amount of time. And then it's all through fight camps. Like I I am probably one of the most emotional fighters you'll ever see sparring. Like I will be crying through most of our sparring rounds. I'm not even exaggerating. Like especially with small gloves, I'm I'm still getting used to hitting hard. Not hard, but like you know, committing to shots in sparring. And um yeah, I I just I just cry a lot because I just I want it a lot. And I think it's, you know, for any females that are out there and they get emotional on the mat, it's like it's totally normal to be doing that because obviously men normally get a little bit more angry when they, you know, they're not doing very well whereas females are more likely to get a bit more emotional. I am 100 100% the embodiment of that. Like I am just a big crier sometimes. I never used to be like that, but I feel like the further I've gone along, everyone thinks it's going to get easier and it never does. It never gets easier. And um in fact, it probably gets harder just because your opponents are going to get harder and harder and the pressure is going to build up. So um yeah, it's just one of those things where like I am like if you talk to me, you would never think that I'm a fighter because I I just don't come across like that at all. But then when I'm in the cage, that's like it is like a proper switch for me. Like when I watch myself, I'm like Like I can't believe that's who I am. Like so, so I did a video before like on Instagram about how I have to watch my fights before I fight and just remind myself of like, oh yeah, that's what I do. That's what I'm capable of. Because, you know, little old me, when I'm sparring, I'm just not not as aggressive. Well, sometimes I am. Sometimes I am, but like majority of the time I'm a bit like, oh, I'm not very good. I'm crap. Like, I've had one one bad sparring round and that's it. But, um, yeah. So, I I feel like there's very mixed emotions when I go into a camp, but normally in a cage, I'm I'm pretty good. I'm pretty good at holding the emotions back normally. >> Yeah. It's interesting that the one time that you actually didn't feel good going in is the one time you actually lost. And then after that, did you always like like anticipate going into fights like just to keep a positive mindset the whole time from there on out because of that experience? Yeah, I think I think like some sometimes like you know your fight camp doesn't go as well as you'd like. Sometimes you know you could get ill, you could get injured that there's so many like factors that goes into a fight camp that could like derail what you normally go through. Like I remember like my I think it was my third professional fight. I remember, you know, I normally watch my opponents right at the start when it gets announced and I'm like, "Right, okay." I'm I'm a bit more like methodical in like, "Oh, they do this and they do that." Like, and I try and make them beatable. Even if they're undefeated, I'm like, "Right, they do that. I can I can capitalize on that." And then this one time in my third fight, for some reason, I rewatched her fights and she she had just come off like a knockout in like 30 seconds. So, I rewatched it and I was like, "Oh my god." And I couldn't shake the feeling that I was going to get knocked out. Like I just thought, "Oh my god." Like she had like a really good left hook and I was like, "I've got to be so so careful about that." And I just remember like in my head thinking, "Do not get counted with that left hook." And then that's that's the only fight that I've gone to a decision because I watch it and I watch it now and I'm soing angry at myself for not capitalized on. There's so many opportunities that I could have capitalized on, but like my mental like my mental like game was just not there. And it's, you know, I used to watch interviews of of fighters saying like, "Oh, I just I just wasn't feeling it when I was in the cage. I just wasn't myself." And I was like, "How can you not be yourself when you're in the cage?" And then I had that experience and I was like, "I get it now. I get that I couldn't I couldn't put it all together. I didn't want to go into the fire and risk losing." So, um, yeah, it is weird like that, you know, the different feelings that you're not always going to feel. I I never really feel the same when I go into a fight. Like I'll always be a little bit different. Sometimes I'm a bit more like wary of things. Sometimes I'm really like fired up and I'm like this is not winning kind of thing and you know sometimes it's the opposite and I've got to be really wary. So I think you know it's it's being able to I think maybe surrounding myself with people that are like sometimes I have to have a pep talk before I go in there like they're like somewhere you you know you you'll knock this girl out, you'll do this, you'll do that and like I'm like okay okay I just need some like reassurance when actually I should just reassure myself. Like now I'm I'm saying out loud I should re reassure myself. But yeah, it's just hard like because no no fight is going to be the same. You're always going to feel different when you go into it. Um, so yeah, that that's uh it's just different every time. >> Yeah. Know, I like what you said there as well because every fight is going to be individual and especially when you go to pro, the stakes are higher. Like you said, it's never going to get easier. It's going to get harder because every fight that you have, your next fight is always your most important fight because it leads on to the fight after. And people think if if people think it's going to get easier, they obviously haven't watched from regional to UFC. And that's not saying anything about the regional because this is where the grassroots. This is where we all come from. This is where all the fights come from and it's well needed. But obviously there a lot you see a lot of people that were probably in the regional like you have probably disappeared now and like like I said it's just going to get harder and harder. But throughout your am career what was the kind of biggest takeaway you got from it? Like what was the biggest kind of positive or and the biggest difficulties maybe or obstacles that you had to face and do you have any advice for people around those? Um, so I I definitely think it's it's still a common thing now, but I think getting fights when you're an amateur is is sometimes very very difficult. Like obviously being a bantamweight, I'm bigger than most girls and I don't think it's the most popular weight category if I'm honest. So me trying to get fights in the UK scene, it's either you've got to fight someone that's got like 10 times more experience than you or you know you've got to go abroad or you might get lucky that you you might find someone in the UK that's willing to fight you. I think the problem is now is just like everyone wants to be undefeated and I get it like of course it looks it looks gangster on your on your record doesn't it to not have a defeat but really the amateur ranks are where you have to learn. I know people say that all the time but like you know me losing amateur I remember my coach saying like you needed to lose. You needed to know what it felt like. It sucked. Of course it sucked. I was like you know miserable for two days afterwards. I was like such a downer to be around. But like I needed that loss. I needed it to be like, "Oh crap, this is where I'm weaker and you know, this is what I need to improve on." You know, you can do that with wins, but it's much more, you know, it's more raw when it's a loss. Like when there's something you did and you think, "Oh, I up in that area. I've got I've got to make sure like I'll take care of that." So, I think you've got to say yes to these opportunities. I definitely think the imaths are a route. Obviously, I have mentioned before that it is it is a bit pricey to do it if you don't have sponsorships and you don't have people around you that are going to, you know, donate to your GoFundMe page like I did thankfully. Like people were really generous and I managed to go that way. But, you know, if you don't have those things around you, it is it's difficult to get there, you know, just to sign up and the flights and everything like that comes with it. It's it's difficult. So, if you don't if you don't go through the IMAF route, I don't think it's the end of the world, which most people seem to think that it is, but I don't like I think you can be just as successful. I mean, you look at someone like Chanel Dier, she never did the IMAFS, and look at her now. She's like coming off a TKO win, KO, sorry, and you know, won 100 grand. Like, that's amazing. Like, you don't need to do IMAFS. But, I'm just saying if you do have the opportunity and you can do it, I do I definitely think there is something in it because you're fighting different styles as well. Like the UK, you know, it's been known to not to have the best wrestling. So when you go abroad and you fight someone that's a decent wrestler, you're like, "Oh, this is what it's like to go against a good wrestler." And I'm not saying UK don't have that, but it's like that's probably our weakest area. So, you know, I think in amateur, you've just got to say yes, try and get as many fights as you can, especially all these young ones. I feel so old saying young ones. Um, but yeah, all these all these young upandcomers that are like 19, 20 that are wanting to go pro, I'm like, you know, fair enough. Like, if if you've if you've done everything you want to do, then fair play. But like maybe it is good to get a loss under your belt. Like, and I'm just saying that from experience. Like, you know, someone like Dakota Ditcher, she's never lost at amateur and pro. She's never lost. And I'm like, that's crazy. But like I always think that I know that one day at pro I'm probably going to lose. I know that's that might not be a good mental attitude, but I don't care. Like I'm like I'm realistic. I I'd love to never lose, of course. Like I go into every fight thinking I'm going to win it. Like my wife all the time. But it's just um yeah, you just got to experience everything. Like try and do as many things as you can. compete in jiu-jitsu, do K1 fights, do inter clubs, like do everything you can to get as much experience. So, when you go to pro, you know, you don't feel out of your depth when you go against someone that's got maybe more like more pro fights than you at your debut, for instance. But yeah, I'd just say that I mean the the biggest problem is obviously getting fights, especially for females, especially for bantamweights, you know, the bigger girls, it's it is difficult for us to get matches. So, um, yeah, and you get some scaredy pants that say no to you all the time, so it's a bit annoying, but yeah, that's probably, uh, that's probably about it really. >> Yeah, I I do agree with you. The IMAS the same here. It's not government funded or anything for for us to go over. And I've seen it like there's only so many times that you can ask fans and family for GoFundMes, you know, the sort of way. You'll do well the first time. I've noticed a lot of fighters do very well the first time. when they go to go to second year, you they end up dropping out because like everyone does want to support them, but they're not going to support you every year on year and year. >> But like you said, one thing that I was interested in looking into is like you're saying about getting fights is trying to compile a list of females from the UK, Ireland. >> Uh and then and just have like a directory there so that if someone went in, they can see kind of like tapology, but tapology don't have them separated from pro and amateur is what I've realized. And like if you had weight classes like you can say you can have besidon they fought at 57 59 and 61. Um but yeah no I do agree and Chanel D is actually someone I've been interviewed and I watched her fight in Dublin against Shauna Bannon five years. It was actually the first event I ever went and it's mad how >> now she's it's fight week for her again uh in the UFC. So uh there's a lot of talent in in the UK at the minute. How do you feel about the actual scene? Because I think the UK and Ireland as well is quite bubbling. It's like bubbling hot at the minute for two small countries. I know you have a huge population, but there's a lot of fighters coming out of summer that has a small land mass. What do you make of the of the scene there? >> Yeah, I'm actually like I always think about this like I've just seen I think it's the IMAF youths. I think um I've just seen like a few girls on there that have won that are like probably 12 or 13 years old. Like it's crazy how good these girls are now because they obviously start from much younger age. MMA is a bit more like is a bit more mainstream. so they understand it a bit more. There are gyms that they can go to. So, I think they get into it a lot younger. And um you know, I'm looking at the amateur scene now and I'm thinking like damn, like I don't know how well I'd do against them if I was amateur right now. Like because the standard is so high and it's only going to get better and better. Like I think sometimes I watch amateur fights and I'm like damn these these people could be pro. Like that's how good they are. Sometimes they're more exciting than the pro fights. That's how good they are. And like with the the female scene like Yeah. Like I think they're only getting better. Like you look at someone like Rosa Berry for instance, I think she's seven and0. She's like a triple champion. What? Like that's unheard of. That's amazing. And like to see someone like that and I think my goodness, I think she's only like 19 or 20. So someone like that, you look at that and you think my like we are in very good hands. Like the talent is top level. And um yeah, I think like even like amateur and pro, like I train with a girl called Ella Bill and she's having a professional fight in FCC, like a debut, and she's someone to look out for as well. Like, you know, she's she's a monster. She she makes me feel bad sometimes. She she makes me feel like this small. But yeah, she she's like a very good prospect to look out for. I mean, obviously there are tons and tons of girls that you could look on topology and they've got like amazing records. they're going to go far and it's well you can already tell. Um but yeah, there's tons of talent and even in the men's side there like you know you know someone like George Stains for instance like I went to the IMAS when he went to the IMAFS and to see us both on Dana White's Contender Series he probably doesn't remember me because like he's such a big deal now but like it's cool to see that he's now on Dana White's Contender Series at the same time that I am and we both did the IMAS in the same year. So I think it's I think it's nice to see all these people that have gone from amateur to pro and everyone's doing really well. like it's um it's nice because I think it it brings the whole MMA scene up because you know people are watching the app like from a younger age and they're seeing all these people go to Kdies or FCC or UFC and you just think oh you know what if they can do it I can definitely do it. So I think we're just paving the way for other people that are going to come after us in the next few years. >> Yeah. No and like that yourself and George says I really like George you're two really good role models as well for people as well. I think sometimes um that's why I wanted to kind of interview you. I' I've talked to him previously, but use that like we obviously we started about you talking late. If if there was anyone thinking of Well, I say like it was 25, but like if there's anyone that was in their mid20s or around that kind of area and they thought that it wasn't for them, what would be the advice that you give them? Obviously looking at your career is one, but like men like what would you say to kind of if they were on the fence to push them in the way of actually trying to compete? Is there any advice you'd give or any benefits that you found uh personally, not just in the MMA? Like did anything bleed over into your personal life that helped you or did it make you a more humble, a better person? what what advice would you give? >> Um, I think it's just that you've got to like not listen to people that say you're too old because that's what I did at the very start of my amateur career. You know, I was I was I remember coming up maybe yeah, like I was 25, maybe 24 at the time that I started training MMA and you know, I was coming up with another guy that was like 16 or 17 and my coach always thought that that guy would get in the UFC and like I had already passed it even though I I hadn't even started yet, you know? I think um there's a lot of pressure on people to start really young and you know everyone thinks that just because you know they started a little bit later doesn't mean that you can't you know be the best in the world like yeah I was 25 when I had my amateur fight and then we had co sake that that took loads of time out of me so I couldn't I couldn't like obviously compete or anything and then it just kind of I had to play catch up with people like I was fighting girls that were 19 years old and I was fighting women that were like 28, 29, like I had a load of different range types like of ages and you know it normally the more mature the women like the the stronger they seem to be like you know I'll go against you know someone like Ella she's I think she's mid to late 20s I can't remember but you know she's strong like when you go against younger girls like that they're not as strong obviously but you know they they'll get there eventually when they hit their prime but I think I think there's a proper stigma how young you need to be when you start MMA. Nah, you don't you don't need to do that. Like, you know, there are loads of girls in the UK right now that are you started at the mid or late 20s and you know, look what they do. Like Shauna Bannon, like I mean I know she obviously had like loads of is it kickboxing? I think that's what she's from. >> You know, she got into the UFC what 30, maybe a little bit younger. And you just think, well, >> it's it's proved time and time again like you don't need to be a young spring chicken to get to the UFC. You just need to be really hardworking. You've got to think of yourself like you started out late. You're like you're in a race with someone and you've got to try and catch these people up. That's how I looked at it anyway. And um you know, it is what it is. You can't you can't be you can't be dwelling on the fact that you only came across MMA when you're 25 years old. It is what it is. I mean, you just got to you know, put in the hard work, put in the dedication, and you know, that's all you can do. you know, you know, the amount of times I thought, oh man, like I wish I picked this up at 18. But, you know, maybe I would have liked it, maybe I wouldn't have liked it at 18. I was in a different place. I'm a different person now. So, now that I've got it, you know, a little bit later and I've not been any in many wars and because I've I started off a little bit later, I think, you know, my body still feels pretty good. I'm I'm acting like I'm like 50 years old. My body feels it feels good. Like this is the prime of my life. like this is, you know, you see UFC champions that are like 37, like Chef Shenko, she's 37 or 38, something like that. I know she started a bit younger, but, you know, it just proves that you can, you can still be the best in the world, even if you start late. And, um, you know, that's what I want to prove to people is that, you know, I remember my coach saying maybe I was a little bit too old to ever make the UFC and it kind of put a downer on like my whole life basically. And then, you know, seven years later, I'm fought And watch content series. So, screw him. You know, >> I'm assuming that's not your coach anymore then. Or is it? >> No. >> No, it wouldn't because that wouldn't be something that like if someone showed if No, if someone showed promise and willingness and determination to turn around and say, "Oh, you might be a bit too old." Like you said, Chevhenko uh Glover texture, I know he's a he's a male, obviously. He was 42. Was he 42 fighting for a title? Paul Reed from the UK. someone who I follow, he started fighting at 35. He fought till he was 40 something, got 20 something wins. >> Crazy. >> I think it's about more. So, obviously the mileage on your body as well, I think counts as well. How many fights you've been in, how many wars you've been in. You haven't been in many wars as we said. And I think it depends on the mindset. And there's so many different things that go into it. For someone to say that someone else, they think someone's too old to do something. Unless you're actually out of like if you can only compete until you're 35 and that's a rule and you're older then I'd say okay you can say that because you can't legally get in but the fact to to to do that so I want to congratulate you for not listening to them and going forward and completing your dreams uh and then there is so much more to come going forward oh no actually I want to touch on you're FCC fantastic promotion that's why you've had all of your your professional fights one thing I noticed about you was your you talked about like your grappling was your forte but You're very vicious with the knees like and you're very you seem that do you feel when I've watched I've looked back on some of your fights you seem to look like that you hit a little bit harder and you're a little bit stronger than the females that you're fighting. Is that just like is that like you said your mindset of viciousness training like what is it like what think gives you that little bit extra more than and the other girls that you seem to have fought? Oh, you know what? Like, ever since I was an amateur, I've had a few people saying that I hit really hard. And I I just I kind of never believed it. I was a bit like, "You're just being polite. You're being nice because, you know, I'm a girl. I get it. Like, I'm not going to be as strong as you." And you're saying, "Oh, you're pretty strong for a girl." kind of thing. And I just took that the wrong way. And now I take it as like, "Yeah, I am. Like, I am powerful. Like, I am." Um, I, you know, I never really thought about it until, you know, I moved gyms and I was doing pads with people and they're like, "Oh, you really, you hit really hard." I'm like, again, I was just thinking, "You're just saying that. You're just saying that to make me feel better." Like, I can't really take a compliment, which is my own my own problem personally. But yeah, I just think um, you know, it was my second my second professional fight when I got a knockdown of someone. I think it was twice in a fight and I was like that I was so buzzing like I I remember when they lifted my hand up as a winner. I was like don't cry some don't cry. So I was like looking down like don't cry about this. I was just like I was so overwhelmed. I was like I can't believe I managed to knock someone down with one punch. Like that's that's so good. Like that's surely every like everyone wants to to have that kind of power. So to know that I have that in my arsenal is very very cool. like I I just never thought I'd be able to do that kind of thing. And you know, hands off to like Gaz that I work with, he's my strength and conditioning coach. Like he's worked with me for like three or four years now. And like my gas tank's really good. And you know, my strength has gotten so much better. So it's just like obviously training is important, but strength conditioning is like, you know, for you know, trying to recover properly and like making sure you don't get injured and making sure that you're strong and your cardio is good. So, you know, he he's the reason why I've probably got that much power now. But yeah, it's just very surreal to think that, you know, I've gone from being a grappler to people thinking I'm a striker. And like I love striking, don't get me wrong, but like grappling's always been my favorite and it probably always will be. But if someone wants to try and like trade with me, then bring it. Like I'll I'll have a tradeoff with you. I don't mind. And you know, I think, you know, you need to push yourself into areas that you don't necessarily think you're good at because otherwise, what's the point of doing MMA, like if you're a grappler and you're not willing to strike with someone because, you know, that's all you know, you need to broaden your, you know, your skill set. And what better way to try and do that in a cage. So, yeah, having that kind of power, I was going to say comes with great responsibility, but that's so lame of me to say Spider-Man there. Um, but I watched it last week. That's probably why it's in my head. But no, I just I just think it is pretty cool to say that, you know, I've gotten a few knockouts and stuff like that. So yeah, I just never believed in it until that second professional fight and I was like, "Oh my gosh, like I actually can knock someone down." So yeah, it was it was that that moment in time. >> That that's a that I say that's a fantastic feeling. I'd say once you hit I would assume my thing would be when you hit them hit the ground, I actually be standing there going if it hadn't happened before, what do I do now? Like >> people see that? Did people just see what I did? Did >> you just see that? And >> um as well I think you had a unique submission. I think it was an amateur though a knee bar. You got an bar in was it knee bar? >> I did get a knee bar. Yeah. >> Do you want to talk just through that how it happened and how you felt after cuz I think I think it is quite unique. I'm trying to think I've seen loads of them attempted in this country but I don't know if I've actually seen one finish the fight. So do you want to talk us through how the knee bar came about and how you felt after because it is quite a unique thing to to win with. >> Yeah. You know what? I I remember my coach um my old coach going through knee bar things from from closed guard and I was just thinking like we were drilling it con continuously for like six, seven weeks and I was like ain't no way I'm going to be on my back in close guard like she's not going to take me down. I remember being really cocky about this for some reason. I had no right to be this cocky. She had had like 10 bites and I was going in with like a merely two and0 record and um we had just been drilling it and then like I remember like I I was actively quite good on the ground with her. I remember like you know I was getting her back. I never finished the rear naked choke which I have to live with until this day. You know it's ridiculous I didn't get that. And then the second round I didn't have it. And then I remember just coming out in the third round it was a total fight and I was so tired and like I took her down. And I got her back and then she managed to reverse it and then I was like, "Oh my god." I remember thinking, "That's it. I've lost." Like I I don't have it in me. And then all of a sudden she started standing up and I was like, "This is what we've drilled." So I was like, I underhooked her leg and I came around. I was like, she did exactly like what I wanted her to do. And I was like, "Well, well, here it is." I was like, "I've got a knee bar here." I was like, "Oh my god." Like try and push it on as as soon as you can. And then she tapped. I was like, "Oh my god." Like that's insane. Like I can't believe like I managed to pull it off. And it was something that we drilled over and over. So, it just must have been in my head to do it. But it was amazing. Like a lot of people said to me afterwards that they had never seen it in amateur to get a knee bar and I was like feeling pretty good about myself there. But yeah, it was it was that was a very cool submission to get amateur for sure. Yeah. >> Okay. So, obviously we've talked about FCC and being in there being undefeated as well. What's it like fighting on FCC? They've got a fight pass as well, so you've got that exposure as well, I think. was that one of the things that kind of played into your mind was I'm visible to Dana White here. But talk to us about FCC, how they've treated you. I've had numerous conversations with people, promoters and stuff like that in FCC. They seem like a really good uh promotion to fight for. What's your experience with them? Yeah, I think since like since the my first fight, they've been nothing but like helpful with everything, you know, even promoting us as fighters, promoting, you know, wi with obviously like the editing that Chanu does. Like he does everyone's video edits and it's crazy how good they are. Um, and you know, you got Molly and Adam that are doing the matchmaking, so they always try and do like decent fights that are good matchups. You know, I've I haven't really got a bad thing to say about them. like you know when I first went up there and I met everyone you know doing interviews and stuff like little old me amateur I've never really done interviews so I was a bit like I was a bit nervous to go there and you know talk to them about all of my fights and what I want to do at pro and everything so everyone's been super super nice and they've been nothing but like wanting to promote me and like you know egging me on to try and you know when we were first talking about a belt I was like oh it'd be really cool if one day we can do like a female professional belt and And then, you know, they did it for my fifth fight. So, it was pretty cool that I was like the first person to fight for that belt at professional rank. So, yeah. I mean, I think I think they're in line with like Kro now. Like, I think they're the upand cominging kind of, you know, especially now they've got so many people signed to the UFC that have fought on there or, you know, someone like Curtis Campbell or someone like me that has only fought with FCC and now we're like both in Dana Watts Contender Series and he's in the UFC now. So, I just think it goes to show that like the prospects that they've got on their cards are like, you know, they're the next wave of fighters to come through. So, if you are on FCC, I think you'll be in good hands and they'll be good at promoting you. And yeah, I just think um it's it's definitely a good route to go down if you are aiming for like bigger promotions down the line, especially like something like UFC. They've definitely got your back for that. Yeah. >> Yeah, 100% they do. And isn't it good cuz obviously years ago it was you fight in a region scene you go to cage warriors was the only kind of option for people in Europe. How does it feel for a fight? I know obviously it's been FCC for you but the for other fighters as well like coming through your gym and stuff that they've got so many options. You don't just have you've got the likes of Octagon now. There's a lot of I've seen a lot of fighters from the UK and and Ireland especially have gone and really prospered there as well. And there's a good there's a good level of promotions across Europe in the likes of Amsterdam, FFL, uh I think there's five series as well. How does it feel even obviously you went down the FCC route but to for a professional to have those many options compared to years ago there was only kind of one route. Did you always think you'd find a way regardless because there is more options now than when you would have started watching in 2019? >> Oh yeah, there's there's definitely like way more options that you've got especially in Europe. You know, if I'm honest, I was I was meant to fight on Arez in France, you know, that promotion on UFC Fight Pass. But I had a contract with them and then they just couldn't ever match me. So, I was a bit like, this is a bit pointless waiting around. But, um, you know, it it I think it's obviously good having this many promotions to fight under, but then there is the problem because there are so many promotions. You know, I've been begging to fight someone from the European scene for like my whole FTC career, but it it just turns out like girls are are either contracted or they're signed to different promotions, so I can't fight them and then they can't fight me. So, you know, it it is obviously he's got his good and bad points about that kind of thing. But you know if you you know especially people from my gym obviously we've got good contacts with FCC and and probably other promotions in the UK and even you know in Europe you know that it you know I've got the first footsteps through the door and now like everyone else can kind of follow me in that kind of direction but you know if they want to go different places I mean I'm sure it won't harm their career but yeah I think I think it's good having this many options you know especially if you've got the like the fighters to fill up the pages you know the the fight cards and that. So yeah, I think it's good having options. You know, you know, things didn't work out with AIS. So then there were talks about me trying to go on Kro when I first turned pro and then that fell through. Like I had lots of different options, but they this kind of never I never fulfilled it or they never fulfilled it. So it's nice to be with FCC and they they they wanted me on their show. So they were like, "We'll fly someone out, you know, from Brazil or Poland or whatever. We want to try and get you matched." So I think that's a difference now is that you know it's it's how hard the promotions have got to fight to get you an opponent because it's just like it's it's hard to get matched especially at female you know so it's nice to you know they want me to be on their show so like they're like a fan of me so they want me to be part of their show and like you know it's good for both of us you know we could both um grow on grow for each other so yeah I think it's good having the options but yeahcc was just the right one for me. Yeah. And it turns out obviously another question as well being the first person to hold that belt like in the grand scheme of things like overall the UFC belt is where you want to be but like to be part of history and be the first person to hold that belt. Uh like how does that feel? How does it feel to be part of history? Because no one can ever take that from you. That can never be taken from you no matter what happens from here on out. Like what or do you are you still processing that or do you still look and go okay this is really really cool? >> No it's it's very very cool. It's like it's um I remember when I first started out as pro, I always said that I wanted to get a professional belt under, you know, under me before I ever went to a big league promotion. I'm not saying FCC isn't a big league, but obviously it's like it's it's still regional. I guess it's still reg it's mainly UK fighters. So, you know, when there was talks about me potentially fighting for a belt, I was like, that's spicy. That is spicy. And like, you know, I know it didn't go it didn't go to five rounds, but you know, to have the option to go five rounds before ever going to the UFC, I think that's good experience as well. Like, you know, if you ever have the opportunity to go for a professional like belt, obviously you're not going to say no anyway, but I mean, it's good experience. It's good experience, you know, to try and test yourself on 25 minutes instead of 15, you know. I mean, I really hope I never have to do 25 minutes cuz that would suck. Like, I mean, all these people that go to decisions, I'm like, your gas t must be amazing. I mean, I'm I'm saying my gas tank is amazing still, but I'm just saying like if I can do it before the end of the bell, then I will try and do it. So, yeah, it is pretty cool. Like, no one can take that away from me. Not like, you know, even if someone else comes up the rankings and they they eventually win it, I'll be like, "Well, you're second in line. Don't take it. It's still obviously an amazing achievement, but um yeah, it's pretty cool to no one could take that away from me. You know, I was the first professional fighter for females anyway to get the belt. So, um yeah, it'll always be special for me for sure." >> Yeah. And there was something interesting you said there as well like the likes of Ari's looking at you. So obviously they've been looking at you and they were a fan of you. How does that make you feel as a fighter and a person to know that there's promotions within Europe like actively watching you as a fighter because of what you're doing? >> Yeah. It's very surreal like I'm just a person you know like I started off thinking that I if I'm honest I never had as like massive aspirations for myself when I first started at amateur. I was a bit like I'm literally just going to see how it goes. And then the on, you know, I got to seven and one or something at amateur and I was like, right, I think the next move is professional and then we were, you know, I even get a management people trying to sign me and I was like, wow, like I can't believe people want to sign me. Like I didn't think, you know, I'd ever get to this point. So even the promotion side of things, you know, I had areas and cries trying to match me. I was a bit like like I watch these I watch these promotions and it's just crazy to think that they want me to be on their on their cards and it's it's it's very humb like it's very humbling, I guess. Like the is that the right word? Humbling. Um yeah, it just feels um yeah, it just feels like you're wanted and like you know um hopefully exciting for people to watch so it brings eyes to their promotion as well. So yeah, having that, you know, having that at your start of your professional career, you know, cuz I think maybe I was a good prospect to amateur, so they're looking at me and thinking, you know, she's a good prospect to have in our in our rankings straight away. So, you know, some people have to go on smaller shows when they first start pro. So when I was offered areas, cage, and FCC, it was a bit like I was like a little bit like, "Oh my god, these are these like big fight cards. I'm going to be part of that. That's very cool." Like, you know, some people have to wait years to be on that. and for for me to have it on my debut is just insane. So, it was it was very humbling and um it's still like a pinch me moment. Like I remember doing my first interview in FCC and I was like I can't believe I'm getting interviewed as a professional fighter for UFC Fight Bass. It was like Yeah, it's it's still very like a Yeah, it's a pinch me moment all the time with MMA. It's just crazy. >> Yeah, there was something you actually mentioned about the media that I want to want to circle back to and see your thoughts on as well because I do this in in Ireland and I'm expanding more into the UK. Obviously we we were talking I done a couple with the likes of Chanel Dion all years ago and you said like the first time having to go and do media stuff like that. Do you think that that there should be more coverage for the amateur scene? Cuz the reason I did it was I wanted to do this and I wanted to cut my tea at a level where Joe if mistakes were made you can learn the ropes and stuff like that. Do you think that that should be there for fighters amateur level with promotions so that when they do go to the likes of Cage Warriors FCC and they've got and then all of a sudden because like we're just sitting here on a zoom. Yeah, you going to go to FCC, you've got you've got your ring lights, you've got lighting, you've got this that and I'd say that is quite overwhelming going into a situation like that. Do you think there should be more work put into med not media training but media outlets or or for experience for amateurs to get that? So when you go pro all of a sudden you've got a fight week or a fight camp coming up, you don't have to do any media and then all of a sudden you have to do a lot of media. So, do you think there should be some sort of a bridge between amateur and pro where there's like a transitional period where where amateurs can learn the ropes of media? >> Yeah. Yeah, definitely. I know like it's one of those things where you have to learn it as you go. I mean, like I I don't I don't know how well I interview. Like I feel like I do okay, but it's just it's like having to try and I don't know like bring your personality to the interviews as well. Like trying to make sure that people know who you are as a person. like it's hard sometimes in an interview situation. So yeah, get going to these bigger shows at professional when like you always have media obligations and you got to do interviews and you've got to do photo shoots and you think what the hell am I doing? Like I don't know what I'm doing. Like you know you got to do poses and I've I've never done poses. I was like like turn to the side and try and look mean. I was like I don't know how to look mean. That's just not who I am. So it was just like a bit crazy going from like I've never done anything to summer you're going to have to look angry in this. So yeah, it's it's um it's probably a good area to to kind of highlight for amateurs. Like it's it's it's one thing that you're having to fight and it's another thing that you're having to promote it and then do interviews and do media obligations and it's all very overwhelming at pro. So yeah, there probably does need to be more coverage for amateur. I think there was a little bit when I did the IMAPs and I think I might have had one or two interviews here and there but it was never like you know yeah it's different when you sit face to face with someone because it's like it's a lot more not intense but it is intense. It's like you've got the lights around you thinking like oh my god I'm a big deal now like I've got lights around me I've got people with multiple cameras getting different angles you know I've made it and you know for for going from nothing to that yeah it's pretty overwhelming. So there probably needs to be a bit more like even after fights like the post fight shows of maybe going and talking to someone like cuz then obviously you're still on a high and you still you're just going to be yourself and your personality comes through. So yeah, there probably needs to be a bit more media training for amateurs. Bless him. >> Yeah. No, and that's why I kind of I used to go around to shows and do that and do that kind of work, but I just financially and just traveling around the country for 5 years. I just can't physically like and they all seem to in Ireland there's two weeks that have four shows and then the eye mask are on and I'm like how am I supposed to even start and for weeks there's nothing. So I ain't do not that I do nothing I will still do but then all of a sudden >> I try >> I try to do a minimum amount for each show and try and make everything even. So now I'm going right so I've got like triple the amount I usually do in three weeks and then I've got IMAS which I want to try and touch on as well. And I think obviously because there's no money really in media a lot of people don't want to do but it's my passion it's my hobby and I love to be able to show see the likes of you and putting this interview out it's going to mean a lot to me to get here and number one you do interview very well that's why we're after having such a long conversation in my opinion and I I treat them like a conversation more so as well and a lot of the information I've got out there's a couple of things I want to put as as clips out there for you to inspire women and also you are an inspiration to women because of what you've done you've laid ground work in FCC with the title and stuff like that how does Does that make you feel as as a human being? The emotion of being an inspiration when someone says that to you, what does does how do you feel? >> No, if if I'm honest, like I God, I remember getting like a message off one of my um teammates. She's only like 16 now, but she was maybe 14 or 15 when I just won the belt or something. And I remember getting a message off her and she was like, "You're such a big inspiration for me like like and I just trained with this girl." And I've got that. And obviously like I'm already emotional because I've just won. And I looked at I was I almost started crying. I was like I'm just a person. Like I'm just someone that trains and like I just, you know, I'm just like everyone else. But you know sometimes people put other people on pedestals when you know everyone's just a person. and um to have, you know, especially girls like it means I'm not saying it doesn't mean a lot when guys give me that kind of um inspiration quote, but it means more when it's it's girls because obviously they probably want to go follow in my footsteps like I'm I'm assuming because you know they train as well. So I never used to think of myself as a role model. I never used to think of myself as anyone's inspiration because I was just like I'm just a person. It's like to me I've like I've not even scratched the surface of like what I want to try and do in MMA. So I'm there like you know yeah I'm 6 and0 and I'm going to be on Dana White Contender Series. This is a bigger deal now. Like this is like I'm hoping that people look at this and think yeah that's exactly what I want to do and she trains at this gym or she does this. You know I want to try and do that as well. So maybe I can reach out. Like if if anyone wanted to talk to me about these kind of things like I am an open book. I'll be very open with people. I've had a few people message me about how old they are and, you know, I've kind of given them a little bit of hope to be like, "Oh, maybe I can do it, too." And I'm like, "You absolutely can do it. You absolutely can." You know, I think um it's important to have, you know, girls like me and I I look up to people like Chanel Dy. I mean, she's younger than me, but I look at her and I think that's that's who I want to be. Like, I want to be someone in the UFC. I want to have £100,000. You know, I'm very desperate for that. And you know, it's cool having those people and like I've trained with her before like for the IMATH training. It's it's very nice to see everyone kind of coming up and like you know the women at the moment now that are in the UFC or like at high level pro ranks you know we have to know that we are inspirations and role models to other girls and like I just want to you know I'm desperate for people to look at me and say like oh she's done it through talent and hard work and not had to go through any other weird route to get there for for any other reason. So, I'm just hoping that other girls will look at me and be like, "No, I can do that without having to go down these other routes." So, I'm hoping that yeah, I I can be a role model and an inspiration for these girls that are coming up or girls that are just starting, you know, at 25 or 30, you know. It's possible. It's possible. >> Yeah. And that's as well is one of the reasons why I really wanted to talk to you and I've really enjoyed this conversation was I think you are an inspiration and a role model for females and even males if they want to look towards someone as well that if they're kind of starting late and go well this girl done it this lady done it and she's able to she's on day in a white contender series but look I've really enjoyed this conversation. I'm going to let you go but I've got three questions for you and they're fight related to your own fights as well. So number one what is your favorite finish that you've had today whether it be amateur or pro. It can go from anyone. >> Now, my favorite fight to watch is probably my most recent one because of it was a defense of my title. The opponent was really really good and I managed to get a knockout. So, I was I was very happy with that. That's probably my favorite fight. >> That's your Is that your favorite finish or fight? Because or is it a bolt and one? >> No, wait. That's my favorite finish. That's my favorite finish. Yeah, I do like the knee bar. That's That's a close second. That's a bit spicy. I like that one as well. I like that one. I thought you were going to go for that one, but then again obviously I don't know how you are feeling. So then obviously so that was finished. So what's your favorite fight that like your favorite fight where you think maybe you formed the best or maybe you didn't perform the best but you won like so what's your favorite fight and why is your favorite fight? >> Okay, so it's maybe my third professional fight. I remember it was I think it's Karolina Arujo, right? So in this leadup to this fight, I had six opponent changes and she took this fight on a week's notice. the absolute gangster that she is. And then she came over and I remember having a stare off with her and thinking like, I'm just gonna bulldoze you. Like, I'm gonna absolutely smoke you. I I really underestimated her. My mistake because she was probably by far my toughest opponent. Like, you know, as in like she gave it back and I wasn't able to finish her on the feet. I was like, "Wa, this is like crazy. I thought I'd be able to run through you." She did not let me run through her. And that was a bit more like my bad for underestimating her. So, since then, I've never underestimated someone in my life. fight. I've never done that. And um I think that was a very back and forth fight. And that was a bit more of a dog fight. I did have to dig a little bit deeper in that fight. It went to the third round. I managed to get finished, but I was a bit like, gosh, she she took me through my paces. She was a she was a dog. Like that's probably my favorite fight to watch back for sure. >> Okay. I actually have one more question based off that answer and just I want to kind of get out because you answered one of them. Obviously, you said you overlooked her and you'll never overlook anyone again. when you were in there in that moment and obviously you had initially overlooked her and she was giving it back. How did you keep yourself calm and composed? Because when people you have a plan and you think something's going to happen like they say you get punished in the face and it changes plan. You went in thinking you were going to run through her and when you didn't was there any sort of panic or kind of hesitancy or doubt then and then how did you manage that to stay calm and then finish the fight out? >> Yeah, I think I think like round one went by and I was like it's fine. I've got I can do it in round two. And then it was the moment between rounds two and three. I was I remember saying to my coach, I was like, I'm going to take her down. I was like, I think that's the way I can finish her. Like I in my mind, I know I shouldn't be like this, but I always want to finish people. Like I always want to put a stamp on it and be like, no, I want that. Like it didn't go decision. Like I I won it, you know? And um so I was like desperate to try and finish this girl who was like 19 at the time. She just didn't care. These Brazilians, man, they're just they're just tough as they come. So, in between rounds two and three, I remember saying to him like, "I'm going to take her down. I'm going to try and submit her." And then I remember she overswed underneath and I was like, I had to work for the takedown as well. Like I finally got it and I was like, like that was a lot of effort to get that because she was even that like her defense for takedowns was amazing as well. So, yeah, I think looking back at it now, I'm just like even when I underestimated her, I think my mindset throughout the fight was like, "No, I'm I'm going to do it, but I just don't know when." And like I, you know, normally I was being a striker now, like I'm this weird striker at professional than I used to be a grappler. So I was like, I'm going to have to go back to like plan B or or whatever I used to be at jiu-jitsu. So yeah, having to go for a takedown was a bit like, oh, it's a bit like I didn't think you'd match me in the striking when she absolutely did. And she was by far one of the toughest opponents I've ever had. So yeah, the mindset was a real real game changer in that one. I had to like dig deep for that for sure. >> Yeah. You know, cuz that that that that comes to mind to me like a fight or flight kind of moment where okay, you thought you got a bulldozer, some people start doubting themselves and then go, not that they give up, but they let the situation get the better of them, but obviously you stay composed when I need to go back and like said between second turn around, this is what needs to happen to finish the fight. It's good that you got that cuz >> especially at amateur level, I've seen it where people thinking they're going to go beat someone and then the boy or girl might be and then all of a sudden they freeze. They freeze. But and I think that's see that's good at amateur. I think like you said, one of the things you said earlier is losses are amateur. They don't they're not nice, but I don't think they mean a huge amount. That's what amateur is there for. That's it's there to learn. It's like doing an apprentice for anything. For the first four years, you're you're on low money obviously in the apprentice is because you're learning and then once you get to that big stage and you need to have the right coaches turn you around. But the last question is what's the fight you learn from the most that you took the most away from? I think uh I looked it the most away from it's probably my four or five fight before I won the top. Yeah, before the title. Um it it was when I went to the decision and uh if I'm honest, I was really down about it. Like even though it was very dominant, I'd like 30 27 or something like that. Like I knew I'd I'd won it. Like I knew I had god it sounds very cocky but I just thought like no she hasn't landed many things. I was like I've definitely won this and then like I looked back on it I was so angry at myself but I was just a bit like you know what like looking back at it now like it's a win. It's a win and it was a dominant win. Like I don't I don't have to finish everyone. Like even though I desperately want to you know it it's okay to go to decision summit. It's okay. Like it's fine you know it's not the end of the world. It's just you know I've always wanted to finish people. I think like that was my forte. it was my forte. It was my selling point. And like when it went to a decision, I was like, I can't say I'm 100% finished bra anymore. Like that's gotten and now it's a bit like, oh, it's not the end of the world to me. Like literally a week later, I was like, it's fine, Sim. You're absolutely fine. So, and it it gave me the tools to know that I could go, you know, three, five rounds. Like you you definitely need to know that about yourself. Like it's great having finishes in the first round, but like going into this the third round thinking like, you know, I might not finish this person and it is what it is. And uh yeah, having the gas tank to go that round and being, you know, I wasn't even that gas at the end of it. I mean, fair play, we didn't do much grappling if any. It was just striking, so it's a little bit less um cardio wise. But yeah, it was just um it was a real eye opener to be like I was so angry at myself, but then literally a few days later, I was like, "No, it's it's okay. I'll get over it. I'll get over it." >> Yeah. No, I I've really enjoyed this conversation. There's a lot to take away from it, and I like how you've explained things, and I I really think a lot of people are going to get from this interview. Um, and I really enjoyed it myself and that's the main thing because I actually personally wanted to talk to you and see what made you tick, what made you who you are and and your aspirations for the future. But I am going to let you go. Thank you so much for your time. Is there anything you want to say before you go that you'd like out there or you don't have to, but is there anything you'd like to say or anyone you'd like to shout out before we leave here today? >> Um, there's there's probably like a sponsor that I need to make a huge like is Nick from Langly Agric Langly Agriculture. like he has sponsored me since day one and um I would not be where I am without him. Like I wouldn't be able to work part-time and do more training. So um massive thank you to him and every other sponsor that has sponsored me along the way. But he he's like the main one. He is the reason why I am where I am. So um hats off to him and obviously all my training partners and coaches at Ronin. You know obviously I used to be a grappler and now I'm a striker, a striker. So, it's very cool to see that that transition and it's all thanks to those guys like Adam, Jack, Silk, Gaz, um, and Range. They've all massively helped me with uh with my striking. So, hats off to them. >> No, I want to thank you so much. Best of luck coming up in obviously the day contender series. I'm really looking forward to it. I've really enjoyed the story and I really hope we have a catch up then after the contender series and uh, enjoy the rest of your day. >> Thank you very much.