Jamie Heaslip | Starting Rugby, His Playing Career & Irish Rugby | Energized Show

สรุป

What is up and welcome to the latest Energized Show! On this episode we have former Irish Rugby International Jamie Heaslip live from The Simpsons household on the show to discuss how he started playing rugby, his playing career & the IRFU. Check it out, enjoy, subscribe for…

ถอดเสียง (youtube_captions)

Kind: captions Language: en okay what's going on guys and welcome to a brand new episode of energized today we have a very special guest on the show this man is a three-time hiding Corp Six Nations he's even won the Grand Slam I'm bit nominate for world played here twice mr. Jamie he slipped Jamie how are you doing how you guys has things it did the medals didn't quite make my my wall here your Simpsons backdrop but many many thanks for and yeah the intro we do Troy everyone gets special intro here over the Android show yourself that makes it a bit easier for us well that was that was Dan you know we'll see what I can do nowadays I was quarantine going for you in the Simpsons household so you can see I'm keeping my two minutes meter distance there's no one here and which is I kicked margin but no it's brand I work a lot from home anyway and you know the only difference is I do meet a lot of people so and kind of meet them out about but so obviously not too dad have done that for last nearly four weeks five weeks now pardon is it getting to you no it's it's fine it's grand and I was kind of saying it's kind of like see it's kind of like school holidays almost you know your school well for me anyway when because I lived a lot abroad when I was younger my dad been posted abroad and all my siblings like 8 10 12 years old and I mean so like they were off doing their own thing and I was kind of left my own devices anyway so kind of it's a throwback for me to a certain degree but I've got a I got a little one half year old as well so and she keeps us busy and kinda you're in her routine regardless so and the days kind of fly by and ya know we kept kept busy and I'll be differently and you know just a different routine that place and yes yeah I'll see Jamie you've had an amazing career and like no one could even argue that for that as you mentioned earlier you is a true day report in the Israel yeah yeah yeah born Tiberius Israel and in December 1983 and yeah I've lived well I was young when I came back from there and lived in Cyprus for a while lived in Kosovo in Croatia for a while and my dad my mom moved to Belgium but I was kind of like a leaving start cycle then so I just kind of stayed at home and I'm kind of day boarded in Newbridge College then and then they when I went to college then mom went Belgium items I stay putting in in Ireland and actually that's I mean it's over at 17 and I've been living in Dublin ever since and was your father in the military background yeah yeah yeah a lot of structured pure life growing up down now we get making the bed in the morning trying you know what I would have rebelled a lot about it but I do need structure like I do I understand the need structure and as a professional rugby player you are given a lot of structure you're initially like given your program you're scheduled for four weeks you know how to go so you're gonna told where to be it's kind of it's the one thing there's a lot of players struggle when they finished that they don't kind of realize that and they don't put structure in place and yeah you know he gave kind of a lot of lessons in terms of discipline routine that sort of stuff yeah when did you first like sir getting into the game Roby as well of course obviously like you're such a cultural background it's it's it's every day here at someone born in Israel pickled air well so I've two brothers who are 10 and 12 years older than me and my dad would've played rugby as well so my older brother played they played in a club called Cara um which used to be really really strong and country club and you and when the base when her base camp was actually a lot busier than it is now um obviously with my dad and he was in the army so he could drop them off the training or picked him up from train whatever making it work and I didn't I played all my own rage will be in NACE and then I went Newbridge College in Baden they knew which and well yeah no it's because then really and you know you could I do I was thrown around as a rugby ball when I was when I was young and then and you know I started playing underage rugby like formally in a club at about he goes eight or nine nice and in their tans would've been the first team I played for and you know that's when I picked it up but I played everything like I played pretty much everything until I was probably about fourteen fifteen and then kind of narrowed the focus down to to rugby just because of time and you're kind of into Leaving Cert cycle and all that sort of stuff and then Jay when you were coming to the Leicester fold it was that just about I was when Victor cross-flow was leaving yeah so I started kind of I suppose you know I went through two different age grades and so when I came out of the Under 20's I was actually kind of would be 19 at the time just because the way my age kind of fell and I started I was kind of put into the Academy for my under-21 rugby year and that's kind of when I started training and laughed and Gary Ella brought me in once or twice and then Deki deccan kidney was kind of the main coach the time in my final year sorry my second last year my third year three years at a four in college he brought me in and quite a and they actually offered me a contract at the end of Secondary College and the third year college and Leinster did an Ulster actually at the time and I turned it down because I wanted to finish college but I was put into the Academy ins instead and so that's when I started I kind of owe for the end of the Oh four or five season four summit play for lens for senior team and coincidentally it's the year Victor finished and then also the end of that season is when Jackie Jackie actually gave me my first contract they left for even came in there and we went that back then for monster and checker came in which was which was which was great because he he was very much like he wants to bring young guys through it was very much like if you're good enough you're old enough didn't have an age restriction on it I'd come through a big and wonder 21 year where we've got to the final of the only 21 World Cup against New Zealand which was the first time I'd ever gotten and so I had a bit of momentum behind me and you know checker kind of backed me down in my first year which was which was big really yeah you were straight away in what adrià time 23 24 I was 21 Oh 21 I'll show you later wasn't 2006 no so I am 2506 was the first season for me okay but the full-time and professional brilliant and then around your straight in there makes him with the big boys and I actually got I got nothing i got shut down with the first game he sees and i played like two of the warm-up games one of them was actually an ace ironically and then and the very first game was like edinburgh way i think everywhere our ass could've been a squeeze actually and members like myself and rob carnies first year and Rob started actually and I was on the bench I remember when he picked me on the bench to choose though I didn't check his office and put Eric Miller at 8 and I kind of thought that I had out with him I was just like I stake my claim going like I'm not here as passenger I definitely want to be you know play a bigger role and you know kind of put the pressure on he kind of put me on just after halftime at age and then I started every every game at age and that season on that season you know it was kind of kind of went from there but I was definitely pushing for the opportunity I made sure when I did get it which was the following week that I kind of I am rabbit with both hands because I think that's important thing with guys to realize is you know when you get the opportunity you want to grab it because and they don't come around that often yeah and then the first time you sort of tasted that big victory was and you're sort of says Nate says not one season at Lantz Rob's you warm dining hope that year was here for a funny clip and then you went to warm and the grand slam with Ireland yeah I was like such a special team and especially year when that happened did you know that that team was extra special and it's a bit of a man I'm like yeah you didn't know you can't you kind of had this plan of guys who had warrior for a good few years but really yeah people talk like people talk about Triple Crowns and stuff but like for me anyway like its championship or nothing like its Triple Crown it's nice it's it's it's not what you're like playing yeah so you had all these guys who who kind of had the Triple Crown and that was the most that they don't at international level and they hadn't really got that stage so not like people like Paul and you know Draco like Marcus Horne John Hayes don't know Callaghan these type of guys who worried for a long long time in that regard and and then you had this mix of young guys coming through like myself Tommy and Steve Farris Rob Kearney Lucas Charles Keaney who's even not or back down what the haters by the way pardon what names by the way but this is like it's funny like I was telling someone earlier about 2009 and final in Europe and I was like yeah at the time Leicester probably were favourites and had the better team it was like but if you look back on on the makeup of that Lancer team you know the amount of lines players or players that became lines and that made up that team was pretty remarkable and it was just that the perfect timing of experience of players who've been there and this ops kind of talent kind of coming through that was being brought through and this a really good mix of young and old an experience and maybe naivety and 1 and 1/2 and but yeah with the Ireland team you kind of you it was our first proper season for like myself and and Robb and Dustin and we kind of we didn't know any better we were pretty ambitious and pretty confident at the time but we didn't have any the baggage of of failing at the last hurdle or anything like that so you know maybe we were naive at the same time but it was it was an exciting time but then like in the background as well you see you gotta remember you very much saw the Oh cliff Duvall was bringing two people because we were going through a massive recession then and gay people be the focus something good and you know I had a lot of friends who had finished college and had to emigrate because of the recession and so he had all that on the background so you had this really weird kind of bittersweet yeah yeah you know and you remember talking to people and then letting you know how much of a highlight it was that with everything else that was going on well almost like from personal point of view it was like one the best years rupee I've ever seen from Ireland it might be the best year will be ever seen although some people talk about beat the All Blacks sport you know when the ground is down that year I'm winnowing cooked that year like almost change orders will be forever and because I can gave us that belief that we go on and we can beat anyone and I'm all safe from person point of view you must have kept few those jerseys cause you scored some big troyzan they're both those competitions boiling Cup final against France in Six Nations yeah I have must be hung it up in the citizens household right now we're in the backroom they're actually in my in my house I have I'm in my office now and there's nothing on the walls at all and maybe there should be rugby related and and it's weird thing because I have them I just haven't done stuff with them the only thing I've done and probably the only thing I'll put up in my office is I framed all my caps yeah from from under-19 under-20 one's a Ireland senior lines Leinster and 100 test cap as well and they're all kind of framed up and that's the only thing I just haven't got it back from the frame reps because I can't go them that's that's it's like I have jerseys I've given all the jerseys to two different clubs that I've been associated with and done nothing with different metals that I have and I don't know it's very weird to put it up because it's a bit Bragi osius when and yeah I'm kind of reluctant to do it but I keep my wife keeps telling me that I should do it but yeah I'll get around to doing something properly Alex Ferguson as well the areas in the tourist without as well he has no football memorabilia in his house well there I know obviously we've gotten into when you've won ground sounds and stuff but just like listening to it is amazing boy there can you bring us back to your first cup like like when did you find out you got called into the squad and like it who was it against like yeah is is 2006 against Pacific Islanders so for that series I was I was training with Ireland I was in the Ireland the training camp squad never getting a look in and then I got the kind of got the nod you know like in civic Islanders game to get first cap myself Stephen Faris knew for sure all got capped I I was there looking up the media thousands and Irish international to be capped so there's a bit of trivia for you yeah I was in the old it was in the old Lansdowne Road as well which is which is playing there yeah really cool place because people forget you sad the touchline tickets which really literally like seats pretty much on the torch line your your bit away nowadays the stadium and and also like it was really old-school like there was a guy in black tie who stood outside the change room but offered you tea or coffee after the game well you're like in all your gear and a mess and it was really cool place to get capped but I you know I found out you can you go training on the Monday and you kind on't want to read into the teens but you kind of you're kind of put in a team that looks like it could be the starting team for a weekend Tuesday then and we kind of announce team you get picked and and then any really weird moment Danny tells me we train in in the stadium vvb I think was in the Thursday to Friday before the game and any kind of clothes me side and goes and you'll never play for Ireland wearing my boots FYI so I was I was wearing my boots and and I was kind of like oh right and and I was a bit like a pissed off that I listened to him but I wore black boots at high kind of white trim down middle these old Ali - boots and I never forget it after that mom I was like nah I'm I'm never letting someone dictate that to me and going forward and that's kind of why I always wore white boots and colored boots going forward and we have that the game itself was pretty cool and well actually it went by in an instant Patti Wallace as well he got to kind of get his first start and it was like a big game for him he actually got my on the match and I'm kind of people were kind of thinking that was Patti's kind of coming onto the onto the scene hombre Blair yeah class classic really skillful and Ike the game kind of flew by one moment the stands out was was getting in between and one to to allow me know what was it it was an Islander winger what was his name not Erlang e I wasn't time to allow you was to allow me the last row me yeah and Shayne Horrigan and getting in a fight and meet middle and literally my life flashed before me because I was like get punched in today's but to allow I am tossed hopefully did standing guard I didn't break out and afterwards and yeah afterwards bit mad then you kind of the tradition at the time and probably still a certain degree is and you know if someone from your team or the opposition team comes up to you with a drink and to toast your first cap you have to have that drink but the problem with that is that's wondering for them but for you that could be all the drinks I had Jim McShane who was our doctor at the time who's also answer doctor was keeping a close eye and mind you me that night to make sure I was able to play and a week later or two weeks later for her Leinster in there in European rounds but yeah I don't remember much of that night because we're all family there and not as actual capping ceremony and but they're all there after at the game and stuff like that and I was pretty pretty cool moment and yeah yeah was it was but then then it was kind of bittersweet so that was like oh six and then I didn't see the Ireland Jersey again until H so bit of a roller coaster but it was great to get started on ferry once you got whole lockers in Hawaii there was a pox one man to take it off if you really held it down for years to come um and deserve be so and you also have the two lines for straining for the moment or come on on one second lads okay my wife is locked out so one second so Jamie went on lawyers for what were they look I don't there are they're mad um like it's the pinnacle right for any guy playing in northern hemisphere in in Ireland or the UK it's the pinnacle it's it's it's it's your Everest in terms of getting there and and it's really weird like getting selected for the squad is like getting to base camp but getting becoming a test line and I'm sorry test line for me anyway was was like get at the top of Everest really and so you know getting into know nine and I kind of like at the time there was there had been a study that came out that like the average career length was about six to seven years you know and that was oh nine so I was 4 years in so I was like alright I'm kind of I'm not gonna get this chance again so when I got it again in 2013 was even more special and because we won that series first time lines on a series since 1997 and you know it was pretty amazing to be a part of um yeah it was rolling like for two very different tours oh nine was probably the last out of all the tours I've been on probably the last old school tour that I've been on and because like social media was moving around camera phones weren't what they are now and you didn't have all these different whatsapp groups 2013 you know the world has changed so much and you know like we went I put it this way you like it oh nine tour you pay it on a Wednesday and Saturday and if you played on the Wednesday the whole squad and we're in the team room afterwards and and there was beers there and if you played you were going out that night that was it right unless you were and you were selected to pay on the Saturday which happened the odd time because of injury but not that much everyone was there and then you know rinse from repeat under Saturday but if you went out in the Wednesday you had to be there for training Thursday okay so it's not like upholstery grant in the pier then you have to like absolutely show up and which was very different in 2013 because you couldn't people would take pictures we had a very different captain at the time and very different setup and I'm just very different environment and it was a lot more great experiences but but but not as old-school a lot more professional for one for better or even though the o.9 tour was very professional but if it's really weird you could sometimes I say like it's like I had a more of a better experience and time on the online tour but we had way more success and so experience in 2013 tour you probably you would have played two different roles though and both like you would have been the obviously more experienced head the second time and then the first time everything's new to you as well so yeah yeah yeah and very different styles as well you know each was very much like just you know you play just do it well there's a lot more more structure around the game we've got and like you have to change a game no matter what your stage you're at or what Coach you're under because you have to evolve or see Jamie with the tears knowing or obviously Pato funnels cotton the test series I was he you were the numeration on both homes but also one got ones with over he made Warburton cotton and then I think Island John was even was cotton well the strange that Oakland was cotton and then he choke again then he wasn't happening yeah because like you gotta remember I was coming from Ireland where mmm good cool it was the cotton and Daniel Pauly was captain I'm thinking back to Jacob you don't like Sofia you know what I mean it didn't really and yeah didn't really matter to me and any good team I've been a part of and usually has a really good leadership group and you can you can kind of they they work in different ways together you know with different characters and but I toned those get sad from the top down in terms of the captain how we want to seem to be in and and you know sound Paul we very different characters very good captains both them and you know I've played more and being under Paulus captain and a lot more so you know I obviously kind of bias sports towards Paul because of that and really good players bro good blokes and great leaders I know I know obviously one your second sort of compare about teams what team do you think was actually better oh nine yeah yeah well what would be like maintain go stand over here I just think that the collective in our nine was potentially stronger than the collective there's 13 however in test 13 there was still some amazing there's a lot of amazing individuals but no nine like you don't remember as well like that Australia team that we've got in 1013 deaf you were not as strong as the oh nine South African team you gotta remember they've just come off win the World Cup just come off winning the Tri Nations they were like look at that our team they were amazing and I think probably the hardest test I've ever played in is that second test where we went right to the wire with them and yeah so I mean that's why I kind of lean towards the oh nine team and and the characters in it as well there was there was just a touch of old school in it what I mean yeah and and the game was still a little bit rough around the edges and the stuff that kind of happened on the field and but yes that's kind of lean towards it which I also think with Eric not knowing team playing sadaqa is a bit more different with the altitude called a France or Spain was like incredible Tabu and if you gave him the ball anywhere within 65 meters he could put it back over the bar so like that was deathly a factor and then JP Peterson LeBonheur like two of the best players in the world like I definitely agree with that like that's an awesome team was tough the range yeah we mentioned scallop bird or John Smith or and you do there you know forwards oh yeah you know who's the center again and de Villiers the videos Pierce piece I mean yeah they're second rows were like math fields and what's his name that lunatic yeah yeah and you know what I mean like it's an alternate a radio is not yeah yeah I think Australia have have struggled a little bit like we've been convincing in the last game and and you know we should have really beaten them in the second test you know should have been at watch series and look you know would you say that's a coil oh you're playing career then the lowest or and so it's funny when I get highlights I kind of say like it's hard to single any one thing out because I kind of look at the whole journey like I'm very very lucky that I know injury pretty much far the end and and you know so I played a lot of rugby yeah it's more about the journey for me to op downs the highs allows the hole to hold off together is what kind of makes a great road the experience for me and I'm looking teams I had a lot of success and there's acid cultures with amazing players so I got to see am a lot of good yeah Jamie just about just before we go we'll go back into your Irish career and just looking back at those two lines tour it's just so we can wrap that up in Boca in both tours which none are spared did you look at and you're like you took like some something from their game or some inspiration or your like the way they pre-prepared pre-match stuff just something that people like ourselves wouldn't see um yeah you pick up bits like you pick up it's weird by the point in 2013 by the time we came around to that I think the Irish players were so far ahead in terms of being professionals and you know so I even by 2009 the analysis that we were doomed was definitely more than the other teams definitely um and in 2013 we were majority of player Irish players are definitely out of professionals and the others there was definitely times and individuals and stuff and nothing they weren't professional but I just think we definitely came at it from a more 360 perspective but you still did pick up things like and like I picked up a lot from like just the way guys it's kind of carried themselves and I think back to the oh nine one like Stephen Jones was was a big influence you know in terms of how he approached game and you you got lots of different perspectives and both coaches and players which are which is great because that you always need that outside eye on something to look at something different or approach something different and that's true bush and then in so I mean yeah I'm trying to think back to that time who were you roommate with the time the to change to change yeah okay I actually know nine in fairness I learned a lot of Amy Powell because he was in like really good Nick and I was like learning off okay how he was taking care of himself to training into diet a lot of the Welsh guys actually had really good clean diets and trying to learn a little bit often that ten thousand thirteen and you know got on well with a lot of different players you know far as these guys and you know working closely with palette hour at a time and you know learning off tip Rick in terms of the lines he was named and how he came and warmed him acted around the rock so you did pick up a lot of different things like that and probably more role specific self than and and the broader sense things and Jamie what made the current doors team we're almost a new phase again under Anna Farrell I'll see the jokes midair was absolutely fantastic I mean feeding New Zealand I think as something that people will remember forever known you once or twice yeah to what do you make it the current set up and you know I'll see the back row is on fire at the moment especially if you take people like Dunleavy back and then I was he masked eating kale and Aris come true like what do you wake the current chair team especially forwards hmmm what am I making them I think they've got a evolved and you know I think we saw that from they played a certain style that which on the Joe that gotten to a level the guns on the world sorry and what they didn't evolve their game and so I think they're still playing picking from a lot of players like the guys who are starting majority guys that are starting right now are still of that ilk and of playing a certain way and I don't think and I think we've been passed out teams have caught up what our play and figured out how we're playing we haven't evolved that we showed glimpses of us in the first two games of the Six Nations before called off but and I don't know if we are picking the players that can play the type of game we need to kick on another gear and you touched on coupling that I think I've got to start you know Kailen Doris and Max Teigen and you know there are two the back rows for example who else you guys say you'd be coming back home like this and that's just sorry that's just Len sir around there's another top coming new your jacket on who months we go with Addison these type of guys who are pushing to start and there's guide to I think are getting picked on and previous endeavors and and I think we need to evolve the way we playing we need to evolve our team or else and we we simply I don't think we'll win and if you give your name more to people who you bring in if you were put in charge tomorrow who would you have them start in 15 I'd start Cain and dyrus all day yeah oh my gosh he is so you bigger find Maxie and I don't know why I just get over the line so awesome it's it's fantastic I think I think I think Matt is potentially the more and potentially has more footballing ability but I think Kailyn hi is is a really good all-around player on both sides of the ball and in any sort of game so if it's real if it's a it's a free fall free-flowing you have the kind of momentum type of game I think max is amazing and so he can roll up his sleeves and do dirty work I just think Kalin you and potentially has more of a 360 approach and I'm clutching at straws I'm a big fan of bottom and there's no kid come true cops car penny at seven who is an amazing amazing athlete and and he'll be an amazing seven but like that's look that's just because I I've seen them come through and then you've also got will Connors who was there and these sort of guys who are putting a lot of pressure on you have Dunleavy coming back into the mix Jack calm come back into mix and again this has only come from one club so yeah you know let's take the last game of guys who started it was in the back row and it was Josh and CJ yeah yeah yeah like you know I beat you know I think they're under a lot of pressure and I don't know if they're doing it off and to warrant keeping their place okay well they good husbands like it was noticed noticeable that Andy did bring in new faces and then people that injured like obviously can't ours got knocked out in just a give you after like a minute which is that's gonna be a pop quiz crashing in a few years to calm poor that it almost looks like we've reverted back to the World Cup team but like it didn't CJ good man imagine the first two games yeah like they've almost hope the game as well and put us on stage I don't know yes yes and no so like okay now we can get into demand the match and who picks man the match not that sort of stuff right it's I have a good idea who was but anyway and you got a look at the effect than this the players on the games just because you do 20 carries doesn't mean you're effective on the game they could be for a meter at it at a time now in fairness to CJ he had pretty good you had some pretty good games and I actually think the conversation started shifting you've gone okay how do you you know you know you start CJ at eight or six you know you put him at six someone I came in at age or or you know or put him at six or what or whatever and and then I think a lot of pressure was being put on peach as well in terms of trying to have more influence on the game not just at line-x and but these are good headaches and for there are there are hurdles of Andy to have and that's what we need we need cut a competition but we also need to see that and we're picking our best players and we're not just going back to guys because of the job that they did for us back in the day you know what I mean they've got to keep stepping up and if they're not we've got to make a decision on it pretty quickly and now it's really interesting gonna be interesting how it all pans out because world rankings this year obviously dictates and qualifying for the World Cup and and maybe that's what was playing into Andy's hand that he just want a bit of a steady ship and you don't want to potentially make all the changes all the changes at one time and because maybe you want to make the changes gradually over a two-year period and then build in that two years coming into the next World Cup cycle so maybe that's why he was leaning towards and but look yeah I still think there's a lot of pressure across not just the back row that's close to my heart but I think across the whole team and there's there's pressure you gotta remember Joey Carberry is injured right now and he'll come back and put pressure on Johnny but you got Ross burn he's putting pressure on him Harry Byrne who's coming through Ross's brother and you know what I mean Jack Harvey was was showing for Women's World Cup dropping he'll come back and your back three is really really competitive Remagen come back to ulcer yeah yeah you know mods is definitely gonna want to throw his name the hack on forward and so yeah it's good that you we're gonna have these selection headaches but I just I just hope that we're picking the best players and unform and we're picking players as well that can can play in a way that our game needs to move towards just once a cross just where I think it went when Andy was appointed like everyone was like what way is he gonna go with this team we actually put out a few Ruby videos in the build to it like who was he who was the action pickers captain and they he remember if Johnny was already injured so we're like maybe he's gonna pick someone else well then yeah a little picking Johnny sacks and so that almost set the tone and what he was going to go for as well because obviously Johnny's getting about 33 34 yeah but who like I mean I didn't really see an argument for anyone else no no no I told you understand that it was like if they pulled this way there was talk about maybe James wrong getting it well like if you had a few changed wrong and then he probably would have started a brought in a whole new side or picking Johnny it seemed like right that's gonna be the tongue he's gonna probably just keep sort of saying team and keep things taking over rather than changing the whole III I think I think James gotta worry about his own game and I'm building as a leader himself and his communication skills in that regard and I'm growing his game a little bit like I wasn't really buying into that argument I think Johnny was the right call and I love you John you as well he'll probably assess it after two years and at that halfway point is I kind of like what England in the last cycle it's like had done harmony then about 18 months out they just kind of know actually okay he got us to this point but he's not gonna get us he's not gonna be broke up so at some point and he's gonna like Johnny would definitely want to be put his hand up go I know the extra code and if I was gonna have to make decision bone okay he is he we bring him to the next World Cup or is he the starter is he is he a starter Dan yeah exactly because that's the other thing you need your guy to be your captain to be a starter I just don't buy into having a captain that doesn't desire great yeah and I don't think I don't think anyone Ellie and it's very hard like I know like example Pete was in the conversation right yeah but it's very hard to say people start again exactly I think when we discussed it we're like at the time the three most guaranteed starters were probably told furlong genjuro in a donee chasm and we're like we're like is probably going to mean the industry they had their position more nailed down than anyone else does and Saxon was the obvious choice because he was later and also I always think it's nice for the Ohio to be like I'll kick a goal or I won't kick it go as opposed to someone else go hey Johnny stick that over there please yeah well that's good and bad isn't it because and sometimes you need to step away and you're over exuberance sometimes might not be the best decision oh he's an I think he a very good leader and he's growing into it and you know and and look it's gonna be a he kind of got a 12 season I suppose really and coming off back to World Cup mixed bag of a starch and to the Six Nations and look we'll see when when they pick back up they finish out the season or coming into whenever next see how kind of unfolds form but and yeah look I mean there's a lot of talent coming through so I think you're gonna see a lot of interest in calls be made and over the next season or two because now's the time you gotta start bleeding these guys to get from the gametime experience coming into that let's say 12 months 18 month period out from from the next row Cup and Jamie do you ever feel when people are being selected that just say when your painful answer you are an eight maybe and then you have Jennings and China Bron on either side do you ever think that like that play into a factor that you'd be more you actually pick the entire Lancer macro that they're more use each other you for Ireland this is yeah just like in terms like pick them like the four row if you pick the lens from row like they screw them every week together I mean like there there is that sort of I don't think so and I think you get to a stage where players is just good enough mm-hmm international level they should be good enough to be able to to be able to get along playing each other and you know we're playing so much with each other and the RFU are able to put them together because it's also contracted you're able to organize these different camps and they get so much time together that I don't know if that is really something that should be factored in and I think you should pick two packs best players doesn't it come from look it goes through peaks and troughs in terms of some teams get more players in than others you know I mean I started an iron team that was I think was pretty much I look back now it was pretty much a starting pack was monster bar myself you know what I mean so um you know it got that's the way it goes some things reform they kind of get more international players out of it and then you know kind of like Ireland 15 and I'm like geez whatever just consider cornet the Leinster team and let them do the business because you know obviously being the powerhouse lens or at the moment yeah you know we all have our own biased Ward's but I think and look I well I think what's happening is what Stewart is done with Lancer is that Joe is laid a really really good foundation and I think sure it has evolved and built on top of that and I think what you're seeing is all these different players playing that certain way in this new kind of a ball way of playing built on that Joe kind of Schmid foundation so it's a case of maybe they've gotten that competitive advantage and the other teams weren't necessarily caught up with that and lens have also been have invested heavily in their Academy systems they're very lucky that they probably have they do have the biggest catchment onto player through the school system firstly and then in terms of volume anyway in the province and you know but the other clubs haven't necessarily invest in the same amount in their underage systems anyway so it's kind of a double-edged sword so I think like yes like like we lower you lens are able to pick from that big deck you know I mean that they use on average like 55 players I think a season and it's insane you know I mean and they've got that competitive advantage so yeah you can I they can feel that you know two or three different twenty three man squads over a three or four week period and and still be competitive with some of the best in Europe and it's a great place to be in but I think what you're seeing from debuts before which is a wise move is that he's ID and a couple of different bottlenecks in terms of position and the fact that like lends to have a bigger playing population and are able to kind of use that faunal is like they naturally hit a bottleneck and he's starting to move those players around to Ulster to connect to monster and and I think it's better for the player because they'll get more opportunity and then the knock-on effect of that is that clubs have become a lot more competitive and balanced and then that will obviously have a better benefit because you have a lot more guys claim and first 15 rugby which gets more competitive and feeds into a better 15 hopefully friend yeah I think at the end of it we just all want around to get back back on top well there Jamie LC obviously were one called man and there we feel Ian creepy I'd like James Haskell on the show he was played all over the world Tommy bulbs mental Ospreys and they're under Trimble actually said daddy if you have one regret you wouldn't like to play somewhere else as well and would that have been a would you warm and cool is that do you have any regrets never complaining for a plane abroad or anything not really no like no I looked at like say well I looked at at Weiss seriously and any country isn't and yeah in did you did you what year was it was oh nine and so the way the contracts used to be was if you had I think was five five starts against six nations there's and our countries you automatically and renegotiated an international contract and so I hit that in Oh 809 season so my contract became was up for negotiation and what I actually wanted to do was sorry and it was no nine and so as my contract was coming up in 2011 that was it it was coming up in 2011 and World Cup and it is my country came up in June 2011 World Cup was obvious leaves September October 2011 and what I actually want to do was sign like a three formal contract they see the end of World Cup and then I wanted to go to Japan play in Japan and go to southern hemisphere playing sudden Hemisphere rugby and then come back basically hopefully for the summer tour or the following season I put the I if you would do us they were like nope it's either a three-year contract or nothing yeah and that's what I want to do because like oh wow I can I can travel the world with this and I get that Bush yeah it didn't happen and so state Landsman and the only other time was 2000 and was it must have been 14 or something like that my contract was up and too long was was it was a pretty serious offer and I just always say that most probably the French girls came not and I just got to state well the way he got was how close to God I should say is that I had a house picked out and Wow and and it was pretty nice it was you know house picked out on a hill looking over to Mediterranean with a spoon pill your butterbur at the beret as well you know and and so it was it was picked out I had the contract from two lon and beside me in the car and I was driving out to the RFU on the week of the first tests must be thousand thirteen thousand fourteen and and yeah basically my agent was going in for a kind of like do-or-die meeting with the I of you and I arrived and he phones me up goes nope they they've hit the number you want and that was that but like I basically was like ready to go and and was just kind of it was up to very few if they basically wants to keep it or not yeah you can start taking your friends sessions well yeah there's a whole business side to the game that you you very much have to and I'm glad that I did I've seen how quickly then it for me and you know and how other things are trance transpiring but ya know it there's a there's a business I pity game that you have to address and look at mmm unless you're you're in business no Jamie and you're so part of a obviously bars and open what else have you got on your books different businesses in the in the Sports Tech Data world in the FinTech world and in the media digital media world hug love asleep and I was in a business that helps kind of mom-and-pop shops called point needed that we recently sell them to Google in January and when he works for pointing actually know something who works for point a yeah yes so I was an angel investor appointee and so yeah like I kind of did that and I'm spending a lot of time offender right now but I kind of spend time across all different companies and all I my biggest interest is in sport to business of sports and and I'll probably look at how I kind of come back to that world down the line but and now I'm very much you know all about and kind of making sure that the businesses that I'm involved in are I hope to be able to and currently get through this crisis and and come out the other side Britain's great show your entrepreneurial spirit because why she remember seeing you um new sock Obamacare and I was like Jesus Jamie's guy's head screwed on like there's no tomorrow so I've seen I loved broadcasting side a visioning and get involved nap but unfortunately me rugby is quite a niche sport globally and particularly in Ireland it's not a big market and there's not it's not something you can make it consistent living off going forward you know what I mean so you got to think it along game on these things and I love doing it I'm gonna I'm gonna keep doing as long as people that mean and you do have to kind of think it along game and I've always thought that it's better to own the business that you're in so that's kind of what I'm trying to set myself up for yeah if anyone's been whoever's been watching now I'm sure he'll take a voice on board alright Jamie I know we've taken uh like a big part of your day boy there before we wrap up we do always ask people move the best ferry to pay head against and who's the best player to play with so do you want to let us know so actually just froze there so close I'm sorry before we wrap things up we usually ask people who's the best player they played against and who's the best player if they played with so you want to let us know and I always say and Thierry Dusautoir was probably the hardest I went against her and like physically he was just like wasn't a big man but hit the wall and and either you're running into him or you're attacking him you know what I mean and he just kept coming just kept coming and coming and you'd be out every rock himself up okay he was just relentless and and a very nice fella I always thought he was a lot of a lot of lies that are yeah he wouldn't be have a point with him like and but then and who else played with and probably eastern italia was probably the best players I've ever ever been with tied with because he he his standard was the same no matter if it was dragons on a Friday night or it was you know Claremont and semi-final of Heineken Cup and he played unbelievable standard and I was probably one of the most talented individuals you know that that I've ever you know ever play with he was so talented you got to put it this way it's put in context the All Blacks tried to get the international rules changed to make him an all-black and because he played for Fiji to me for a couple of minutes you know when he was young and that's how much the All Blacks wanted him so we just shows the level of talent that he was asked well actually brilliant Jamie M as Barry said thank you so much for a time actually wonderful chat with you and if you are watching this video guys at home make sure to like share subscribe barri as always stay energized